Out With the Old & In With the New: The New Covenant Part 2
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“…to see Jesus is to see the Father according to John 17:9 because they are the same God.”
This statement does not conform to the Scriptures:
The Son “is the image of the invisible God…” (Colossians 1:15)
The Son, “being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high…” (Hebrews 1:3)
There is a very clear distinction illustrated here, and we are misguided if we seek to dispose of that distinction.
Therefore, according to the Word, to see Jesus is to see the Father because Jesus is the Father’s image.
“That apparent contradiction we have come to know as the mystery of the Triune God, and we ought not to be surprised if we cannot comprehend it.”
No doubt we cannot understand this doctrine. We are scripturally commanded NOT to understand it. The doctrine of a triune deity comes to us directly from the Halls of Babylon. Ephraim, I do not mean to chide you, but Trinitarian doctrine and dogma just will not withstand scrutiny. We can prove conclusively that Matthew 28:19, as it exists today, exists in a corrupted form. We can prove it. Again, we can prove the counterfeit nature of the Comma Johanneum. Trinitarian doctrine was added to the Manuscripts and, by extension, the translations. Now Erasmus and Eusebius (the men most directly responsible for deforming the Word in this instance) admitted to the charge of ‘alteration’, but they claimed that their additions were made solely to better explain the ‘truth’ of Trinitarian doctrine. That is what they said. Trinitarian doctrine is a purely occult construct. This is important to us now because we are instructed to ‘know’ our God; and we are instructed to be baptized into ONE NAME ONLY. All of New Testament Scripture records that we are to be baptized into the name of The Son. Matthew 28:19 is the ONLY verse which contradicts that mandate. There is no second witness for Matthew 28:19, and the evidence show decisively that the verse was changed after the infamous third century ‘council.’
“They perceived by sight that Jesus and the Father are not the same entity…”
They perceived correctly. The Word came FROM the Father. That is, where before the creation of the Heavens and the Earth, there was One; there are now Two. It is written there will again be One. This understanding does not conflict with Messiah’s words that He is ‘one’ with the Father, because it is also written that the disciples will be one, even as Messiah is one with the Father:
“And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.” (John 17:11)
Now does this mean the disciples are God also? Of course not. But this single verse destroys the argument that The Father and The Son are the same entity because Messiah said He and the Father are one. They are one, but we must wrest the meaning of that statement from the Scriptures, and not from the doctrines of Catholic or Occultist men.
“Moses did not see God but a manifestation of God in the form of the Son of God.”
Moses didn’t even see that much. The passage from Exodus includes:
Exodus 33:20
“And [God] said, Thou canst not see My Face: for there shall no man see Me, and live.”
That tells us the other verses which say Moses talked to God face to face, must be understood in the figurative sense, which the strict definition of the terms used in those verses provides for amply.
Exodus 33:22
“And it shall come to pass, while My Glory passeth by, that I will put thee in a clift of the rock, and will cover thee with My Hand as I pass by: and I will take away Mine Hand, and thou shalt see ***My Back Parts***…”
This is MOST EXCELLENT – I’m glad you brought this up, Ephraim. Please read carefully:
My Back Parts = H268 אחר אחור ‘âchôr ‘âchôr
Per this word, in the Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament:
“Theologically, the only instance [of the word 'âchôr] that calls for discussion is Ex 33:23, ‘thou shalt see my back, but my face shall not be seen’ (KJV, most versions the same). But in no other place is the word used for the back of a person’s anatomy. This is ‘gab’ or ‘gaw’ or ‘orep.’ The word ‘âchôr means ‘back’ in the sense of direction. Joab saw the battle before and behind him (II Chr 14:14). Ezekiel saw the apostate twenty-five leaders facing the east with their backs toward the temple, i.e. it was behind them (Ezk 8:16). Is it not therefore probable that in the theophany of Ex 33:23, the emphasis is not on an extreme anthropomorphism saying that Moses could see God’s back but not his face? Rather, it was meant that Moses could see the glory and the afterglow behind the Lord as he passed by, but his very presence could not be seen. Of course the anthropomorphism is possible and not even objectionable, but a semi-physical distinction between face and back is apparently not the strict meaning of the words.”
That is, strictly speaking, Moses got to see God’s ‘wake’ as He passed by – and did at no time catch even a glimpse of the presence of Himself.
“…it appears that in the back of their thinking God the Father is the supreme God and Jesus is sort of a lesser God.”
Jesus is ‘lesser’ than The Father merely by virtue of the fact that Jesus (The Word) became separate from The Father, and then He (Jesus) took on the form of Adam-kind. Jesus died and was raised in the form of Spiritual Adam, but even so, in that exalted spiritual form, He is still ‘less’ than The Father, who shall *BECOME* all-in-all. (Here it is actually the ‘all’ which does the changing, and not The Father.)
[His Name means – I am that which I was, that which I am, that which I shall be. It also means I am that which I am BECOMING. The four letter Name of the Most High encompasses all of these meanings, and more, in a virtual time-warping, all time-encompassing envelope of all things; past, present and future.]
“They would consider Jesus to be God but not the supreme God and the authoritative God.”
That’s because right now He isn’t. He WAS. And He WILL BE.
“…(in their mind) God the Father is more authoritative than the Sermon on the Mount given by Jesus, the Son of God.”
Messiah’s words carry precisely the same weight as The Father’s words. Messiah speaks The Father’s words. When Messiah speaks, it is no different than if The Father Himself were speaking.
“The Mosaic Law and the Ten Commandments are two distinct sets of laws.”
This statement betrays a very significant mistake in scriptural insight. The Law of Moses is nothing more than the Ten Commandments expounded. The two are identical. You can find ALL of the statutes and ordinances of the Law of Moses (which is only the Law of Moses as The Flood was the Flood of Noah – it is God’s Law. It was God’s Flood) summarily pronounced in the Ten Commandments. Not a single part of the Law of Moses cannot trace its roots directly to one (or more) of the Commandments. This is actually a very serious error you are making, Ephraim.
“…the Old Mosaic Laws which I consider no longer valid.”
Really? Have you read Paul?
Galatians 3:15-17
“Brethren, I speak after the manner of men; Though it be but a man’s covenant, yet if it be confirmed, no man disannuleth or addeth thereto. Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ. And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul that it should make the promise of none effect…”
But here you are, Ephraim, telling us that the New Covenant has made the Law of none effect. You can find no scriptural backing for that assessment. Rather, all of the verses of Scripture point starkly AWAY from such an assertion, to the age-abiding statutes and ordinances of the Law of Moses, which is the Law of God.
“…Jesus as God gave the ceremonial laws to Moses…”
Would you show me even a single verse from Scripture addressing these “ceremonial” laws? The very concept is un-biblical.
“He didn’t, but could have said…”
You are specifically warned not to do that, Ephraim. You just suggested a change in the written Word. You cannot put words into Messiah’s mouth and hope for a happy ending. Well, you can hope…
“Some think, teach, and preach that Israel and the Church have different redemption plans.”
Only in error. The Church is Israel. Israel is today, in the main, ignorant of his identity. The people who stole the name ‘Israel’ (even true Judah would have no right to that name – the name belongs to the birthright holder; that is Joseph, and by extension, Manasseh and Ephraim) are not Judah. The Bible tells us under no uncertain terms who those people are. It is shocking and yet another powerful confirmation for the far-reaching inerrancy of the Scriptures. I can show you using nothing but the verses themselves if you like.
“If God desired to be the Messiah, which He is, it would be necessary to appear as a man, which He did.”
Yes. But by doing so, He made Himself both ‘LESS’ and ‘OTHER’ than what He WAS. And yet He IS. But He is NOT now as He will BE, which is similar, if not identical, to how He WAS.
“The Old Covenant (Mosaic ceremonial laws) is no longer valid as a means of obtaining righteousness…”
BROTHER: The Law of Moses (no such thing as ceremonial law) NEVER DID convey righteousness to ANYONE at ANY TIME. The fact is this, and Paul says so repeatedly…
…The Law did then what it does now, which is to teach. That is why the term TORAH would better be translated (not to mention understood) as INSTRUCTION (which is what it means) rather than Law. God’s INSTRUCTIONS do not perish. His Instructions abide today just as they did from the beginning. The purpose of those Instructions is to be a guide along The Way back to the Tree of Life. The Instructions themselves cannot, nor did they ever promise to, impart righteousness to the follower. Only the Perfect Man could ever fulfill the Perfect Law perfectly. We have our righteousness in Him, because our Father is good. We cannot perfectly fulfill the Instructions as He did, because we are made in the image of Adam after his corruption. We ourselves are corrupt. We must be reborn into the image of The Son in order to fulfill the Instructions. We are (hopefully) being re-crafted into the image of The Son, who Himself is the image of the Most High.
You misunderstand the Instructions. Your intention is to dispense with an indispensable component of the very process you hope to partake of. You must re-assess your views on this matter, and you must re-asses the men and teachings to which you lean for strength in your understanding. They have weakened you, for the moment immeasurably. You are at an impasse.
Hmmmm, you must be a Jehovah Witness. No wonder you and Amminadab teamed up on me in the previous article. You two are related.
“you must be a Jehovah Witness. No wonder you and Amminadab teamed up on me in the previous article”
Ephraim, how on earth did you come up with such a conclusion?
What exactly is it from any one of Walter’s posts (ever) that gives you the impression that he is a JW, or that he has teamed up with Amminadab?
Walter and Amminadab were arguing on that previous article! And you even said, you agreed with Walter!!!!
Shheeeshhhh…. Victim complex much?
Or can you man up, tighten your overall straps and properly address Walter’s point/s of contention?
This is the article that Ephraim is referring to:
/prophecy/2015/07/the-abode-of-the-dead-2470998.html
This is Ephraim lying:
“I have occasionally written an off-center view, but I do read the offered corrections and if I am wrong then I change it, otherwise I attempt to make my point but Walter is doing an excellent job at the moment.”
I believe you are looking at the wrong post. The one I was referring to is Food Defiled or Undefiled: New Covenant Part 1
No at this time I cannot address Walter’s point/s of contention. Perhaps you can do it for me.
Why would I? He’s addressed you on your article. Besides, I agree with much of what Walter has written.
Ephraim, Walter is as straight a shooter as they come. You’d be wise to engage him, as you will see he has much to offer.
I’ve been in many debates with Walter before and, though it can be hard to stomach some of his criticisms, it serves to make you stronger in the end.
Don’t take any of this as a personal attack. He’s here to help.
Proverbs 27:17: “Iron sharpeneth iron; so a man sharpeneth the countenance of his friend.”
Must I be a Jehovah’s Witness? I’m surprised by your outlandish speculation. Maybe next time you’ll do me the courtesy of asking rather than accusing.
You’re wrong about that too, Ephraim. Just as you’re wrong about me being in ‘cahoots’ with Amminadab, as the comment board of your own article ‘The Abode of the Dead’ should have made apparent to you. I don’t collude and I don’t cahoot, and any apparent agreement I had with Amminadab on your previous article was merely circumstantial. He’s a Seventh Day Adventist, which you just now have conflated with the Jehovah’s Witnesses.
Accuracy is important, Ephraim. Attention to detail is important. As a self-professed follower of Messiah, you owe a greater attention to your surroundings than that which you exhibit. You owe a keener eye to the specific particulars. The particulars matter. As they do in life, even more so do they matter in the Scriptures.
If there is something specific in my initial post to which you object, perhaps you would do a brother the courtesy of pointing it out. Otherwise, what are we doing here? Are you teaching? Are you qualified to teach?
You are right. I was out of line and I apologize. I will have to study the matter before I have an answer and that may be a while.
Good form, Ephraim.
Then we’ll see you on the boards in the future. I always make sure to check in on your articles whenever I see one of your posts. There’s always worthwhile material in your work. But the business of answering questions is often not an easy one.
For the record; I’m not a member of any sect or denomination – all of which have risen from the sea of misunderstanding. Not that thousands of denominations should come as a surprise to anyone – the Word is multidimensional brilliance, and we are bringing our limited intellects to bear the task of comprehending its meaning. All I am is a ‘Wayfarer’ – a traveler along the path in search of Messiah’s voice, hoping to lead wherever He takes us. I’m still learning to distinguish His voice from my own.
We have to go a long way before we find a brother or a sister making such an honest and modest statement as yours above. From where I’m standing, that looked like lessons from the Word put into action. A rare thing indeed.
EDIT to change:
“…hoping to *FOLLOW* wherever He takes us…”
…Revelation of truth…in the world and in the hearts of men….I can feel the spirit…..As more is revealed, on the worldly side of things, I find small details that run with deeper spiritual meaning. Discernment is necessary….deceiving spirits are everywhere…..Most of them are the nicest people. Good looking, too.
Yeah what ever, the trinity originates from Egypt as the 3 solar deities of the ancient world. Osiris = the dark sun, judge, jury and executioner of the dead = solar minimum activity. Ra = judge, jury and execution of the living by fire = solar maximum activity. El = the all compassionate = balanced solar activity. The three names amalgamated into one osirIS+RA+EL=ISRAEL. One god, 3 aspects. QED
The son is the reborn new sun. Horus, Dionysus, Mithras, Baal, Dagon etc etc. There are many allegorical stories for the new born sun, 25th december when it raises from the grave. Dionysus is the Greek version, instead of son of Osiris and Isis, he is son of Zeus etc, as a half human half god, his message was to emancipate yourself from state slavery, he was crucified for being an anarchist, his message of freedom from slavery is completely devastating for the psychopaths ruling the world. Which is exactly why Christianity was invented in to twist it to mean the complete opposite, OBEY your lord and master, you’re worthless sinner sum. OBEY.
By the way… common sense depicts one truth that exposes this Trinitarian error with great ease. If Jesus, the Holy Spirit, and the Father are ONE SINGLE GOD combined, then riddle me this. Why is it the Father knows the date of the second coming, yet Jesus does not? It’s truly that simple! Jesus said plainly in…
Matthew 24:36, “But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.
That passage alone proves Trinitarian theology a deception of the enemy. If Jesus and His Father were “one” as the world defines “one.” Then Jesus WOULD know the day and the hour of His return! How can Trinitarian theology answer that? Simple common sense proves the Trinity doctrine is blunt error. Who can we thank for such a doctrine as this? From the mouth of Rome itself, it is proclaimed…
The Trinity “is the central doctrine of Catholic faith. Upon it are based all the other teachings of the Church.” Handbook For Today’s Catholics, p 12.
Trinitarian theology is just another prophetic peek into the doctrines of demons coming from Roman Catholicism, and the Antichrist. Only one that hates the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit would preach such a lie as this. The Godhead theology simply proclaims the Father has a Son that is in direct agreement with Him and His Holy Spirit. Ellen White put it ever so plainly when she said…
“The great Creator assembled the heavenly host, that He might in the presence of all the angels confer special honor upon His Son…. The Father then made known that it was ordained by Himself that Christ His Son, should be equal with Himself; so that wherever was the presence of His Son, it was as His own presence. The word of the Son was to be obeyed as readily as the word of the Father. His Son He had invested with authority to command the heavenly host.” – E.G. White, the Story of Redemption, p.13.
http://www.remnantofgod.org/trinity.htm
The Word is God, therefore Jesus is/was God from the beginning. No “elevating” later on.
John 1:1 “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, AND the Word was God.” John 1:14 “And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we saw his glory, the glory as it were of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.” Exodus 3:14 “God said to Moses: I AM WHO I AM.” John 8: 58 “Jesus said to them : Amen, amen I say to you before Abraham was made, I am.” John 20: 28 “Thomas answered, and said to him: My Lord and my God.”
John 3:5 “Jesus answered: Amen, amen I say to thee, unless a man be born again of water and the HOLY GHOST, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.”
John 20:22-23 “When he had said this, he breathed on them; and he said to them: Receive the HOLY GHOST. Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained.”
John 14: 26 “But the Paraclete, the HOLY GHOST, whom the Father will send in my name, HE WILL TEACH YOU ALL THINGS, and bring all things to your mind, whatsoever I shall have said to you.” The Holy Ghost knows all things, because HE IS GOD.
Matthew 28:19 “Going therefore, teach ye all nations; baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.”
Sorry to break it to you, but the New Testament was written by the first Catholics and the first Bible published by the Church. The Bible could not have been mass produced until about the 1500′s. If the popular heretical belief were true, then only a handful of people could have saved their souls up until that point, because they couldn’t get their hands on one, nor read it. Why did God wait so long to put out the only saving instrument??
CHRIST IS FULLY GOD
1 – CHRIST IS THE IMAGE OF GOD
Christ is the totality of the “image” of God. This means He both reveals God and fully is God.
“Who is the image of the invisible God.”—Colossians 1:15.
God clearly stands out in Scripture as a personal Being. If the Son of God is the very image of God, He too must be a Person, and have all the inherent attributes of Godhead.
“In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.”—2 Corinthians 4:4.
We find in that verse no hint that the Son is in any way inferior to the Father. They exist on the same plane.
The Greek word for “image,” in the above verses, is eikon and means “exact likeness.”
“Who being the brightness of His glory, and the express image [exact likeness] of His Person, and upholding all things by the Word of His power, when He had by Himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high.”—Hebrews 1:3.
“Image” in the above verse is charakter, which means the thing which engraves or the thing engraved with the likeness of something else; that is, a seal. As a seal impresses an exact image of itself upon the wax, so Christ is the exact counterpart of the Father.
2 – CHRIST IS THE LOGOS
Christ is also the Word (logos in the Greek)—the total expression or embodiment of all that God is. Two outstanding “logos” passages are found in John’s writings.
“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by Him, and without Him was not any thing made that was made . . And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us . . full of grace and truth.”—John 1:1-2, 14.
“That which was from the beginning . . the Word of life.”—1 John 1:1-3, 14.
3 – ONLY CHRIST FULLY KNOWS GOD THE FATHER
In some passages, it is very obvious from the context that the sonship of Christ directly shows that He is divine. One such passage is John 5:18-25. Another example is Hebrews, chapter 1.
Jesus was conscious of a unique relationship to the Father. He spoke of Him as “Father” or “My Father.”
Jesus had a totally unique relationship to the Father, one which no one else has or can have.
“All things are delivered unto Me of My Father; and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal Him.”—Matthew 11:27.
Only God can know God fully. Think about it.
Can you, by searching, find out God? No, you cannot. You can only have a partial understanding of His nature, special attributes, and ways of doing things. But, according to the above verse, the Son knows all about the Father. This is due to the fact that He is totally equal to Him. He too is God! Divinity understands Divinity.
On the other hand, no one can understand the Son except the Father. Why? Because the Son is divine, and only Divinity can understand Him. We can only understand as much of God as He chooses to reveal to us. That is the message of the above passage (Matthew 11:27).
4 – CHRIST IS REPEATEDLY CALLED “GOD”
The deity of Jesus Christ is clearly stated in God’s Word.
“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.”—John 1:1.
In the following passage, notice that Jesus did not reprove Thomas for calling Him “God.” Instead, He commended him for his response. Would Jesus today commend those who try to question His full divinity?
“And Thomas answered and said unto Him, My Lord and my God. Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen Me, thou hast believed. Blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.”—John 20:28-29.
Bible scholars recognize that Philippians 2:6 is a key doctrinal verse. First, we will quote it:
“Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God.”—Philippians 2:6.
“Being” is huparcho, in the Greek, and means to exist. This verse speaks about the existence of Christ.
“Form” is morphe and does not refer to the outer appearance as our word, “form,” does. Morphe denotes the essence—all the essential inner characteristics. So this verse gives us an X-ray view into the inner nature of Christ’s divinity,—and we learn that His inner nature is totally equal to the inner nature of God, the Father.
“Robbery” is harpagmos, which means “to grasp something.” Christ fully knew that to be totally like God was not something to be sought after. Why? Because He already had it; He already had all the total morphe attributes of God.
Here are three other passages, in which Christ is referred to as God.
“Christ . . who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen.”—Romans 9:5.
“Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ.”—Titus 2:13.
“And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know Him that is true, and we are in Him that is true, even in His son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.”—1 John 5:20.
5 – THE DIVINE NAMES ARE APPLIED TO CHRIST
The divine names are applied to Christ in many passages, including these:
“For unto us a Child is born, unto us a Son is given, and the government shall be upon His shoulder. And His name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.”—Isaiah 9:6.
“The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness: Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.”—Isaiah 40:3.
“Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch, and a King shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth. In His days Judah shall be saved, and Israel shall dwell safely. And this is His name whereby He shall be called: The Lord Our Righteousness.”—Jeremiah 23:5-6.
“And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit,”—1 Timothy 3:16.
6 – CHRIST HAS THE DIVINE ATTRIBUTES
Jesus Christ is shown to have the qualities of divinity—the divine attributes—in several passages, including these:
Omnipresence:
“For where two or three are gathered together in My name, there am I in the midst of them.”—Matthew 18:20.
“Lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world.”—Matthew 28:20.
“And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but He that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.”—John 3:13.
Omniscience:
“And he said unto Him, Lord, Thou knowest all things.”—John 21:17.
“I am He which searcheth the reins and hearts, and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.”—Revelation 2:23.
Omnipotence:
“For unto us a Child is born, unto us a Son is given, and the government shall be upon His shoulder. And His name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.”—Isaiah 9:6.
“Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto His glorious body, according to the working whereby He is able even to subdue all things unto Himself.”—Philippians 3:21.
“I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.”—Revelation 1:8.
(Christ’s divine attributes of eternity and immortality will be discussed later.)
7 – CHRIST HAS EVERY ATTRIBUTE OF GOD
Christ has every quality, every attribute which belongs to the Father:
“For in Him dwelleth all the fullness of the Godhead bodily.”—Colossians 2:9.
http://sdadefend.com/Defend-foundation/Christ-nature/Godhead%20TOC.htm
“We find in that verse no hint that the Son is in any way inferior to the Father. They exist on the same plane.”
You find no hint? A son is inferior to his father – see the Fourth Commandment.
Also, I have yet to hear an argument against Messiah’s very own words, when He not only hints, but flatly contradicts your assertion by saying thus:
“I seek not Mine own will, but the will of The Father which hath sent Me.”
…and thus:
“My Father is greater than I.”
Why on Earth that’s not the end of your argument right there, I have no idea.
You (or someone) wrote:
“The Greek word for “image,” in the above verses, is eikon and means “exact likeness.””
Exact likeness, you say? Is that the definition?
εἰκών eikōn
1) an image, figure, likeness
1a) an image of the things (the heavenly things)
1a1) used of the moral likeness of renewed men to God
1a2) the image of the Son of God, into which true Christians
are transformed, is likeness not only to the heavenly body,
but also to the most holy and blessed state of mind,
which Christ possesses
1b) the image of one
1b1) one in whom the likeness of any one is seen
1b2) applied to man on account of his power of command
1b3) to Christ on account of his divine nature and absolute
moral excellence
Here’s another source:
From G1503; a likeness, that is, (literally) statue, profile, or (figuratively) representation, resemblance:—image.
No, Amminadab. Your sources are tainted. For how long will you persist in puking the work of OTHER MEN onto these boards like a programmed automaton? Won’t you ever begin arguing from your own understanding? You have been warned about a thousand times in the very Book you profess to campaign for, not to do what you’re doing. You’re doing no one any good at all, and you’re making yourself look inept.
“Only God can know God fully. Think about it.”
Recall that I’m not arguing against Messiah’s deity; only His equality with The Father. In light of your argument, and the above quote, consider this:
“…but we know that, when He shall appear, we shall be like Him; for we shall see Him as He is.” (1 John 3:2)
Again, quoting your quote:
“This is due to the fact that He (The Son) is totally equal to Him (The Father).”
Is that so? Yet it is written that God does not change. And you yourself have argued above (contradicting yourself in spectacular fashion) that the Trinity is a false doctrine because The Son is not privy to certain knowledge The Father is privy to. Right there is proof of inequality from your own digital pen, Amminadab. Do you even read these tracts you cut-and-paste?
Your inconsistency is now an insurmountable problem for you. And since it is your habit to avoid or ignore the more challenging and problematic questions put to you, I will stop right here and hope for your reply. I do not find it necessary to refute your post on a line by line basis. You didn’t write it yourself, and you rarely have an answer for rigid opposition beyond a quick retort, if even that.
How say you to these objections? How say you to Messiah’s own words? Is it within your capacity to answer for yourself? or will you seek recourse to yet further citations and quotations, leaning upon the flawed work of flawed men. Will you dodge? Will you perhaps ignore?
THE DEITY OF THE HOLY SPIRIT
The Holy Spirit is divine. His Deity is clearly taught in the Bible. If the Holy Spirit is not divine, then there is no Godhead. It is of interest that those who deny the existence of the Holy Spirit frequently go on to deny the full deity and/or the pre-existence of Christ!
The Holy Spirit is divine.
First, He has the attributes of divinity.
He is Omniscience—The Holy Spirit is all-knowing (1 Cor 2:10-12). The Holy Spirit searches the deep things of the Godhead (1 Cor 2:10). This word, “deep” (bathos), describes the knowledge of God. It is unfathomable to man, but the Holy Spirit understands it (Rom 11:33).
He is Omnipotent—The Holy Spirit is all-powerful (Job 33:4). His omnipotence is seen in the Creation. In Genesis 1:2, the Holy Spirit is seen hovering over creation as a hen over its young. The Holy Spirit was used to give life to created beings.
He is Omnipresent—The Holy Spirit is everywhere present. In Psalm 139:7-10, David says he cannot flee from the presence of the Holy Spirit. Christ taught His disciples that the Holy Spirit would be with them, wherever they might go. This would require omnipresence (Jn 14:17).
He is Eternal—The Holy Spirit is called the Eternal Spirit in Hebrews 9:14. Through the Eternal Spirit, Christ offered Himself without blemish to God.
He is Holy—As with the other Persons in the Godhead, the Third Person is holy (Matt 12:32); He is entirely separate from sin.
He is Love—As with the other members of the Godhead, the Holy Spirit is love; and, because of it, He is able to produce love in those submitted to the rule of the Godhead (Gal 5:22).
He is Truth—He is the “Spirit of truth” (Jn 14:17; 15:26). He is the truth, as Christ is the truth (Jn 14:6). The Holy Spirit leads into truth.
The Holy Spirit is divine.
Second, He does the works of divinity.
The Creation—The Holy Spirit took part in the Creation (Gen 1:2). Another description of the Creation event is given in Psalm 104:24-26. In verse 30, God is said to have done it through the Spirit “Thou dost send forth Thy Spirit, they are created” (Ps 104:30). Job 26:13 reveals that the Holy Spirit created, not only the earth, but also the heavens.
The Birth of Christ—The Holy Spirit took part in the incarnation of Christ (Matt 1:20).
The Inspiration of God’s Word—As the Spirit was present to bring Christ, the Word, to humanity; so He is present to bring the Word, through inspired prophets, to mankind (2 Peter 1:21). The Holy Spirit’s work, in doing this, is similar to the Father’s work (2 Tim 3:16).
The New Birth—The Holy Spirit is an active agent in bringing men to Christ in repentance, forsaking of sin, and willingness to obey God’s laws. The Holy Spirit produces the new birth (Titus 3:5; Jn 3:6), but He does it through the Word (1 Peter 1:23) which He also helped produce.
Intercession—The Holy Spirit is an intercessor (Rom 8:26), as Christ is. The Holy Spirit pleads with us; Christ pleads with the Father on our behalf (1 Jn 2:1).
Ministry—The Holy Spirit is our “Helper” of John 14:16. “Comforter” is parakletos, in the Greek, and means “one called along side to help.”
At this point, it should be noted that the Holy Spirit comes forth, or proceeds, from the Father (Ps 104:30) and the Son (Jn 15:26). This closeness of relationship between the three should not be thought to indicate subordination of the Spirit to the other two. All three of fully equal, but each has chosen a different appearance and activity.
You’ve got it all backwards when you talk about the divine. Get your head out of the man-made Bible and investigate for yourself and you’ll discover we all have duality in us, black-white, yin-yang, positive-negative. The basic tenet of a “Gpdhead” is dual.
The “Divine Feminine” and the “Sacred Masculine”. The Divine Feminine has been suppressed for thousands of years in our patriarchal society.
When the good women on this planet step forward {I’m not talking about the women in power today} and claim their sovereignty and power we will see a transformed society with more love and compassion in it, not this fake christianity that always goes to war in the name of “Jesus”.
american…..you are mingling. not wise.
You’re right Maximus. Iamamerican is ‘mingling.’ He’s mingling Good and Evil, because he’s still eating from the wrong tree.
Iamamerican wrote:
“…investigate for yourself and you’ll discover we all have duality in us, black-white, yin-yang, positive-negative. The basic tenet of a [“Godhead”] is dual.”
And he’s right.
“The “Divine Feminine” and the “Sacred Masculine”. The Divine Feminine has been suppressed for thousands of years in our patriarchal society.”
And he’s right.
“When the good women on this planet step forward {I’m not talking about the women in power today} and claim their sovereignty and power we will see a transformed society with more love and compassion in it, not this fake christianity that always goes to war in the name of “Jesus”.”
And again, he’s right.
What he fails to recognize, tragically, is that he’s describing the natural state of fallen man, begotten in the image of fallen Adam, who tasted of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil. He’s advocating embracing the very world we know by our Master’s teaching we should be laboring to escape from.
Iamamerican is right. The Divine Feminine is coming. The Bible speaks of her plainly. She is therein referred to as ‘Wickedness’ – and that ‘Wicked One.’
Divine Masculine immolated and reborn as Divine* Feminine.
Bruce Jenner.
Multi Gold Olympian.
Man of renown.
*https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Divine_%28performer%29
american, I agree, there is a ‘fake christianity” , along
with fakery all over the earth.
There is a true ‘Christianity’ , actually He came
proclaiming the Kingdom of God, not Christianity.
He did not say “unless you believe into Christianity you will
die in your sins”.
He said, “unless you believe that I Am, you will die in your sins.”
When Satan has undermined faith in the Bible, he directs men to other sources for light and power. Thus he insinuates himself. Those who turn from the plain teaching of Scripture and the convicting power of God’s Holy Spirit are inviting the control of demons.”—Desire of Ages, 257-258.
These false teachers are trying to get you to place your highest faith in their words instead of the plain teachings of the Bible. If you are willing to do it, you invite the control of demons.
“Too wise in their own conceit to search the Scriptures with contrition of soul and earnest prayer for divine guidance, they have no shield from delusion. Satan is ready to supply the heart’s desire, and he palms off his deceptions in the place of truth. It was thus that the papacy gained its power over the minds of men . . Every conceivable form of error will be accepted by those who willfully reject the truth.”—Great Controversy, 523.
….Ammi….great quotes. powerful. “Every conceivable error….” Obviously accelerating, as we speak.